Bumblebee: The Movie Will Be A Significant Milestone For Volkswagen

Discussion in 'Transformers News and Rumors' started by SilverOptimus, Mar 10, 2018.

  1. Galvatross

    Galvatross Dom Dom, Yes Yes Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2013
    Posts:
    7,394
    Trophy Points:
    292
    Likes:
    +10,828
    Because many, but fortunately not all, fans are close-minded and don't know jack about this brand in terms of the big picture. Besides, change is a part of life. Change is a part of fiction. You just...

    [​IMG]

    Time changes everything: The universe, galaxies, planets, satellites, atmospheres, oceans, continents, ecosystems, dynasties of living things, species, civilizations, communities, and individuals. Transformers universes and their status quos and at least some of their characters should change over the time. In real life whole ecosystems and species and cultures and individuals live and die. The same should be true of Transformers. Life, and Transformers, thrives best on the edge of chaos. The best Transformers fiction for me was stuff that either was a completely new Transformers story with new characters (Beast Wars), or stuff that changed the existing universe just enough to be exciting (many examples).

    Transformers is NOT and SHOULD NOT be strict adherence to (name of fiction that introduced you to the brand), even though the Bay movies are, at their core, very similar to the stories many G1 fans know and love. Besides being a brand of toys and fiction made to sell toys, the core concept of Transformers is that Transformers are transforming, alien robots that think and feel like humans, often segregated into warring factions. That's it! When you focus on the core of what Transformers is, you become so much more open minded and move beyond the plethora of "FirRib" and "Is Cyclonus Bombshell or Thundercracker" and "TRUKK NOT MUNKY" mindsets that dominate portions of the fandom.

    Frankly, I love most changes. Not all, but most. If the changes make sense in context and are executed at least somewhat satisfactorily, then I am good.

    If anything, I wish more people would actually stick to their guns when changes are implemented rather than half-assed change to appease the whiners.

    Did you even read my post? Because I literally said I am not fond of the opinions of purists of any part of the brand. That includes Movieverse purists. Speaking of, it's funny you mention designs, because fans complained non-stop about the insectoid, metal-shard designs in the earlier films, and what happened when they switched up the movie designs and made them less insectoid and more colorful? Universal praise? Almost the opposite. Now the newer designs are largely derided, and the earlier designs are largely praised in comparison.

    Frankly, I love the G1 designs, and I love the earlier Bayverse designs, and I love the newer Bayverse designs because I am open-minded. I am fine with change if I feel it's executed well enough.

    Personally, I think a large portion of this fandom doesn't actually know what they want OR just wants an extremely nostalgic vision for the brand. The former will complain about the latest toys and fiction no matter what. The latter thinks the brand should play things safe and cater to the interests of fans just like them, not realizing that the world is much bigger than they are, so they'll complain whenever Transformers fiction is not safe and familiar.

    What type of strawman is this? When something Transformers doesn't go my way, I don't throw online tantrums about a brand made to sell toys to kids, nor do I act entitled, as if everything needs to cater to me. There's something for everyone.
     
  2. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    18,315
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Likes:
    +45,157

    I made my argument before, I presented my evidence. Franchises do change they do evolve, but when it comes to the cinematic rendition smart directors chose the quintessential iteration of the characters look and feel consistently, and fans have held their feet to the fire for minor changes consistently. Well, this is what I am a fan of and Bay went in an extreme ridiculous direction. So I'm calling it out and will continue to call it out, no matter how many stupid names you want to make for me. I won't be seeing the movies, my family doesn't watch the movies until they get it right. Luckily for me my family likes their scifi to be interesting and well directed. I will do my part.

    Did you see the Shape of the Water. DelToro took the character Abe from Hellboy and created an masterful unofficial origin for him.
    We could get something on that caliber one day if you stop supporting direction that includes:
    - Swinging testicles on Devastator,
    - Bumblee Bee peeing on people,
    - Dogs and robots humping legs,
    - Murderous face taking Optimus (basically the opposite of Optimus)
    - Transformers with zero character
    - Cursing Transformers
    - Racist charactures
    - Random elements, such as unrelated plots, random military guys, blatant product placement, obvious appeals to Chinese viewers
    - rewriting history, apparently humans couldn't develop technology alone and Transformers existed throughout history fighting in every major battle
    - Unbelievably complex living shrapnel look
    - Monstrous hideous robot modes
    - Name slapping, using existing character names on bots that look and act nothing like the charactor
    - Vehicles and Vessels that look nothing like consistent established lore. Open air grey messes that look like they come from any of Bay's explosion movies.
    - Characters disappearing without explanation or appearing for moments never to be seen again.


    They got one Transformer right. Lockdown (but they couldn't let him live)
     
    • Like Like x 3
  3. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    18,315
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Likes:
    +45,157
    [​IMG]
     
    • Like Like x 1
  4. Galvatross

    Galvatross Dom Dom, Yes Yes Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2013
    Posts:
    7,394
    Trophy Points:
    292
    Likes:
    +10,828
    The problem with those was not their existence. It was that they were only used in that one shot. They should have been used as dual maces for some Autobot-wrecking action!

    Movie Optimus Prime is the core character from G1, but the context he lives in is much more treacherous and violent, so out of necessity he has to fight violently at times. He never enjoys violence when in combat. He's good at it, but it's not something he enjoys.

    And when the context changed, what did G1 Optimus do? He said, "Megatron must be stopped, no matter the cost." He runs over and blasts a bunch of Decepticons. He was going to execute Megatron before Hot Rod got in the way. Anyone who doesn't think that is living in denial.

    I'm not saying every robot had character, but how is this different from most other versions of Transformers with random drones and background characters present?

    You act as if that's a bad thing. It's a PG-13 movie. What do you expect?

    I love the idea of warring alien robots using swear words. I'm perfectly fine with it.

    LoL.

    Since when has Transformers not had random stuff in it?

    Which have, for the most part, been done away with in the more recent movies. Not entirely, but they are less of them.

    Subjective.

    And this makes the movies different from anything else Transformers how exactly?

    The world has changed since then. I wouldn't expect Transformers in the 21st Century to exclusively have 1980s alternate modes.

    ???

    How did you become a fan of G1 exactly? The cartoon had disappearing characters in spades.

    Also, that's one thing some of the films do better than others.

    Lockdown is awesome. Glad you agree!
     
    • Like Like x 5
  5. iuJacob

    iuJacob low battery

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2016
    Posts:
    1,254
    News Credits:
    9
    Trophy Points:
    197
    Likes:
    +2,134
    What a ridiculous and petty post. What does Optibotimus even have to do with this discussion?

    You’re picking on someone for the car they drive? Because he saved his money and bought a vehicle he wanted?

    Why?

    ‘Made of money’... The guy has repeatedly stated in his videos that he needs two jobs to stay afloat.

    This is clearly about some weird personal grudge you have.
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2018
    • Like Like x 3
  6. MindChamber

    MindChamber Multi-Media-Masta

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2002
    Posts:
    733
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +315
    It Took over ten years, but that shot of a dusty yellow beetle, with the barren background and human in 80s gear is all I ever wanted to see in one of these movies. Gives me a weird tingle..
    Any shots of Bumble in robot mode with this alt?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Haywired

    Haywired Hakunamatatacon

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2014
    Posts:
    9,019
    Trophy Points:
    247
    Likes:
    +12,909

    Killing at war ain't criminal when there's not a single Bot or Con in those movies who counts as civilian.

    KSI drones doesn't even count as "alive".
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. TheSoundwave

    TheSoundwave Bounty Hunter

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2013
    Posts:
    8,088
    News Credits:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    287
    Location:
    Jabba's Palace
    Likes:
    +15,999
    On the topic of change in the brand, I've kind of changed my views on this over the years. I used to be a G1 purist that insisted everything must homage the source material as closely as possible. Now, I'm kind of more receptive to change.

    A few pages back someone posted photos of characters like Superman, Batman, and Spider-man as a way to justify sticking close to the source material. I totally get that mentality (that was my same reaction a few years ago). Now, I'd argue that those cases are a bit different.

    All of those characters came from a deeper place of integrity and even social commentary. Spider-man is beloved because of the twist Stan Lee put on the character, the suit has become synonymous with that. Spider-man isn't a larger than life hero like most superheroes, he's a kid who's struggling to balance his superhero life with with his everyday life. It's a sort of deconstruction of the genre. To drastically change Spider-man's appearance would disrespect Stan Lee's great vision.

    The difference with Transformers was that it didn't really have this same inspiration. Transformers came from a toyline that was probably expected to be forgotten when it sold out. Even the original cartoon didn't have any real theme or vision behind it beyond selling toys (and typical things like "good role models for kids"'). To ask everything to be like G1 is to basically ask storytellers to only be true to a toy commercial.

    Now I love G1, and I'm fine with things looking like G1, but this is only because of my personal nostalgia for it. That much being said, some of the more memorable things in the brand for me have come from new ideas. For instance, I never really liked G1 Hot Rod. I always thought he was a very average character. If he wasn't the lead during the third season he would have blended with the rest of the young-guy car Autobots with American accents in my mind. On the other hand, Bay's re-imagining of the Hot Rod character is very memorable.

    While we're talking about Bumblebee's design, I've actually come to like Bayverse Bee's robot mode better than the original. Has anyone noticed that those flaps on movie Bee's head are supposed to resemble actual bug antenna? Not to mention the doors look like wings. His battle mask is very insectoid looking. The designers obviously had a lot of fun creating the character, and they used inspiration from real life bees. The original Bumblebee is really just a robot with horns on his head, and they had no real significance. It's a cool design (I love G1 Bumblebee), but there's no reason why they have to stick closely to it. I'd argue movieverse Bee captured almost every important aspect of original Bee while actually adding creativity to it. The only important aspect of the original Bee missing in the Bayverse was the Volkswagen "bug", and we're getting that now (plus, there were logical real-life and story reasons for not including it in he '07 film.)
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. Galvatross

    Galvatross Dom Dom, Yes Yes Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2013
    Posts:
    7,394
    Trophy Points:
    292
    Likes:
    +10,828
    You know what, if an 80s movie with a VW Bug is what makes you happy, even though that's not what I look for in a Transformers movie, then I'm glad it makes you happy.

    I certainly hope this movie is enjoyable to both old and new fans.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  10. Russian fan

    Russian fan Proud Autobot Ally

    Joined:
    May 4, 2010
    Posts:
    2,589
    News Credits:
    10
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Location:
    Wherever Autobots are
    Likes:
    +1,527
    Twitter:
    But, my God, it was so funny!:lol 
     
  11. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    18,315
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Likes:
    +45,157
    He's an example of getting it right, A transformer with his own motivations, acting on them and looking like we'd imagine a live action update to look like.
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Wouldn't mind some green and car fender feet.

    Also look at this face, we could have used more of this style:
    [​IMG]
     
    • Like Like x 2
  12. Galvatross

    Galvatross Dom Dom, Yes Yes Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2013
    Posts:
    7,394
    Trophy Points:
    292
    Likes:
    +10,828
    Don't get me wrong Dinobot Snarl, on this point I fully agree with you. I actually greatly prefer Lockdown, with his visually expressive face and unique character among Bayverse Transformers, to the insectoid-faced Decepticons.

    Frankly, I think it's a shame that the redesigned Barricade, who was a lot less insectoid and more visually expressive than his previous model, got shafted in terms of screen-time in the last movie. Ditto to TLK Megatron, who had a design that did not look like scrap metal and homaged the original in many ways. Welker did a great job voicing him, so I enjoyed him immensely when on screen. I just wish more was done with him, and that the Galvatron-Megatron transition and why he was working for Quintessa all of a sudden was explained.

    So yeah, I'd prefer more antagonists have designs and character like Lockdown.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  13. Dinobot Snarl

    Dinobot Snarl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2008
    Posts:
    18,315
    News Credits:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    387
    Likes:
    +45,157
    I was warming to the new Barricade but wow he got 1 figure and they immediately went back to old monstrous designs.

    I think the new Barricade is another example of what my like expected from. The live action movies
     
  14. optimall

    optimall Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 11, 2006
    Posts:
    344
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    257
    Likes:
    +782
    Ebay:
    Twitter:
    God I hate what we have become as fans.
    I used to love reading the comments after reading an article.
    Lately, I truly beleive we do not deserve this franchise anymore.
    Both sides of these arguments need to take a look at all the things that are catered to them.
    Hasbro isn't perfect, but if you people can't see that they are trying to please everyone, you are blind. The problem is you can't please everyone, but they are trying.

    G1: Has an amazing toyline, Comics, Video games and apps, web series and third party following.

    Movieverse: Gets CINEMA MOVIES (freaking cinema movies guys...), a great toyline, pretty cool third party figures.

    For Pete's sake, be grateful for what you have. There are real problems in the world, and we are fighting over something that should be celebrated.

    All this aside, i have to say you have beaten me, Like Magnus, "I can't deal" with the negativity here.
    Please try to be better...
     
    • Like Like x 7
  15. autobotlongarm

    autobotlongarm Pretty Active

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2011
    Posts:
    433
    Trophy Points:
    122
    Likes:
    +206
    So the first movie pretty much raised the popularity in the Camaro, and it's now celebrating the Volkswagen.
     
  16. BumblebeeNotOP

    BumblebeeNotOP Autobot Second-In-Command

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2015
    Posts:
    1,854
    News Credits:
    11
    Trophy Points:
    197
    Location:
    Looking for a Camaro to get rid of godawful VW Bug
    Likes:
    +4,756
    Instagram:
    YouTube (Legacy):
    Man, how did this thread become so toxic?

    I was hoping for people to see like “shame that the Bug will put out of production”, or “I’m going to miss the Bug”, or something about nostalgia, or a statement that starts out negatively and ends positively. VW’s statement was optimistic, in a way, and it has now been bombarded by posts of pessimism.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  17. MindChamber

    MindChamber Multi-Media-Masta

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2002
    Posts:
    733
    Trophy Points:
    262
    Likes:
    +315
    A good story will make me happy.
    And a transformers movie with a good story will be enjoyable to old and new fans alike, regardless of asthetic and timeframe.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. Autobot Burnout

    Autobot Burnout ...and I'll whisper "No."

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Posts:
    45,102
    News Credits:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    467
    Location:
    [REDACTED]
    Likes:
    +40,126
    What about the people who want something actually new? When the franchise is taken to new territory, we can get even more good things. That's the way things used to be - you either had G1, movies, or whatever show was going on TV. Except then anything that wasn't movie or G1 disappeared because Prime/Aligned was such a colossal train wreck.

    Hasbro shouldn't be trying to please everybody, as you say that's impossible. They need to find something that works, and given what's going on right now? Movie does not work.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  19. DeletedUser_119270

    DeletedUser_119270 Guest

    Likes:
    +0
    Murderprime to Moses? No way. Moses doesn't take faces.
     
  20. autobotlongarm

    autobotlongarm Pretty Active

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2011
    Posts:
    433
    Trophy Points:
    122
    Likes:
    +206
    They're pretty much like one of those ricers at drag races that rig the races so the opponent can get $$$.
    Isn't the Beetle Turbo a thing too?