Honestly, the presumption that "if this were a new male character or characters, no one would be this critical" is starting to become a rather old and hollow argument. Mostly because there's plenty of proof to the contrary.

Drift was taken apart for his writing early on. Even Star Saber's 180 degree personality shift was met with a fair bit of criticism. So to presuppose that if this combiner was made up of male characters no-one would bat an eye has nothing to stand on.

And Smog I think is exactly right, being skeptical and suspicious of them trying to sell/hype up this new combiner and the team is a perfectly legitimate response. Considering how previous stuff was sold up and didn't really meet the hype?

Drift was heavily hyped and actively turned the fandom against the character for the poor writing. Windblade (the first mini) was heavily sold up, and while the art was fantastic, the story met with mixed reviews and ended up a little underwhelming. Dark Cybertron was hyped quite a bit and was messy as hell, narratively speaking. Combiner Wars was hyped even more and was incredibly lukewarm overall (though it had some incredible moments).

So people being a little apprehensive of new stuff being sold as "awesome" is a completely legitimate stance.

And honestly? If you want to keep claiming this double-standard of criticism guy characters face vs criticism girl characters face, how about for the next fanpoll we get a completely new male character and see how the fandom reacts. Because right now nothing we've seen is new. Everyone being introduced is existing characters modified for the the current setting.

 

So we get Dinobot, Cheetor, but no Primal, Inferno, Terrorsaur? Yay for at least two of my faves coming back. So Manta Ray over Depth Charge? I would hope that he does show up, although I'm a bit worried at the balance with the cast here so far: I'm only reading Two preds - if the dragonfly turns out to be either Sky shadow or Jetstorm, and several Maximals. Then there's the whole Vs Velocitron. Are we getting Override involved in this? That would be rather nice to have a race with her involved.

 

Specifically, Piranacon was the Combiner that was "too well integrated" due to the shared interests of the component characters. Of course, that lead to an entirely different kind of dysfunction, where he basically had a totally obsessive, one-track mind... to the degree that he would actually grind to a halt before he would even refuel.

With Predaking, I never quite understood the synthesis, since his components are actually pretty different, and only two of them seem to be what I would call "real hunters". The other 3 are just berserkers.

Though maybe that's how Predaking works... Divebomb and Razorclaw have just enough self-restraint to hold the others in check, who are basically just in a constant state of "KILL! MAIM! DESTROY!"... which explains why Predaking is always on a razor's edge, and on the verge of targeting even his own allies. By any sane measure, Predaking is NOT a "well-adjusted or intelligent" combiner... he's just dysfunctional in such a way that makes him utterly terrifyingly efficient as a killing machine.

Well, in IDW I guess they have some interpersonal baggage. Going by their original personalities, the problem is that they're all slow, violent, stubborn, with a disrespect for authority... which means that a combined version would just be all those things to an extreme degree. Snarl's sulking could cause lapses, Sludge's stupidity brings down their already low average, Slag's belligerence causes him to rebel against Grimlock's authority, etc... I suspect they'd be as screwed up as any combiner.  

Well, they sure haven't sold me on Victorion as a purchase. Individually, I don't mind the remolds, but the colours, the duplication of the helicopter mold, and the fact that they come in a gift set pretty much kills any enthusiasm I have for them. Maybe if they get repainted as new characters with not-eye-lacerating decos down the road though...

zmog

 

At no point was Drifts gender brought into it. Not even once. Also one example is not plenty of evidence to the contrary. The only reason it gets old for some people is they don't want to confront their biases and would rather pretend they don't exist and its other people causing trouble

 

From the sounds of it, the conflict won't be between factions but entire worlds, so at the very least, we won't have to worry about the Predacons being filled with expendables as neither faction exists. Although, it would still be nice to see more Predacons simply because they were great characters in BW.

 

Probably because their only hobby is to kill things, just every one of them gives it a different spin. So Predaking is all about killing things for the sake of killing. And, really, for what a combiner is really needed if not for combat? It isn't really good for anything else, being intelligent or not.

Neh, I was thinking about having Slipstream/Blackarachnia/Nightbird who will have a new toy instead of maybe having Airachnid who has no new toy.
This one time "to sell toys" would be only for the best.

Even a slight chance at having Airachnid... No. Just no. It's too scary to think about it.  

Especially since her toys sucked anyway.
Somehow the only good thing about her, the look, was turned into a quite ugly figures.

 

That's not what was being argued. You said that a new male character wouldn't be subject to "silly" criticisms like exceptionalist hyperbole. Drift is just one rather obvious example to the contrary.

And I don't think that gender specifically is at issue with most of the criticisms of Victorion, though it does factor into some of the discourse surrounding the character (and of course, gender in Transformers is still far from being a sorted out issue, for a bunch of reasons).

For example, some people are even annoyed because Victorion doesn't look "feminine" enough for them, which I think is a whole different issue here... a case of being pro-fembot and somewhat sexist at the same time. But I think that mainly the negativity here hinges around people being (in my case only passingly) cynical about how she seems to be presented as a character and narrative device.

The fact that the toy is ugly as sin doesnt' help, but again...I think that's a whole other issue.  

Actually, other examples were provided. Simply disregarding any argument that ran counter to your points doesn't mean that those arguments weren't made.

Drift, Windblade, Rung, Turmoil, the DJD, Alpha Bravo/Offroad/Rook, etc... they all came with a backlash, despite being largely male-identified... which kind of disrupts the causality you were trying to create there.

In fact, you can probably look at just about any time a new character has been heralded or handed even a moderate spotlight, and see the same misgivings playing out. Even established characters tend to catch flak when it seems like a writer is treating them like a "pet" character. When Hasbro throws their weight behind a new character as a promotion, it tends to come with even more hype, so it's not surprising that "new" characters (ones getting a lot of attention, and perceived as not having "paid their dues" or whatever) catch even more skepticism.

And some people would rather project biases on to others to... well, wait that's pretty much just what you said above... and I'd say that it actually applies to you in this instance. Whenever someone says something disagreeable, responding by claiming that it's due to their sexism is a rather poor discursive technique. I rather like you FFG, but I think you're out of line on this one.

Ultimately, it was an off-hand comment by someone on the panel about Victorion having a "many sided personality" or whatever. I just thought it was funny that they were trying to push the "this is a deep character" routine on a combiner. They could have said "she's a big, strong bot" and left it at that... and then gone on to say something about the team that makes up Victorion. I think there's a hint of exceptionalism there, feeling like they really have to "justify" this big female character... and probably moreso because it's a fembot combiner.

Of course, they'd probably have an easier time of it if they had come up with a smart, consistent, in-fiction way to re/integrate female TFs into the IDW universe ages ago... instead of ducking around the subject. It only prolongs the sense of controversy.

I guess we'll see, eh?

Oh sure, but I'm reasonably certain that even 'successful' mergers like Predaking or Piranacon would never be advertised as "having many sides to their personality".  

zmog